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This entry was posted on Saturday, January 26th, 2008 at 11:44 pm and is filed under Comics.
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January 28th, 2008 at 3:24 pm
It’s spelled “genius”.
January 28th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Doh. Fixed the typo. Thanks for the catch!
January 29th, 2008 at 10:33 am
As a resident of Florida I am very angry at the DNC. They are punishing the Democratic voters in Florida for something that the Republican controlled state legislature did. I am sure that this travesty will go down as one of the dumbest moves by the Democratic party, which considering the record of dumb moves by the Democrats is some achievement. I voted today and if the Democratic party doesn’t take into account Florida’s delegates, I may never vote Democratic again. If Hillary can get the party to reverse their moronic decision in Florida and count the delegates, more power to her. Why should my vote not count towards selecting a Democratic candidate? Why is it a good idea to disenfranchise Florida Democrats? How would you feel if your vote didn’t count?
By the way, the only Democratic ads I have seen in Miami were Obama’s. How come you don’t give him a hard time for disobeying the DNC’s decision?
January 29th, 2008 at 12:16 pm
Alex,
Heya. I’m totally with you regarding the lack of delegates. It’s completely unfair to Michigan and Florida Democrats. It’s totally stupid. I think you and I are on the same page.
How would I feel if my vote ddn’t count? I’m in Virginia. We don’t vote until a week AFTER Super Tuesday. Our vote pretty much never counts. And it feels shitty.
Again, the selection process sucks.
BUT there are rules and if you want to get the nomination of a party, you play by the parties rules and try not to bend or break them in your favor.
Regarding Obama’s TV ads - that’s a smokescreen from the Clinton campaign. Any ads were part of a national media buy and the network couldn’t technically remove the ad in Florida. If you buy an ad during a national TV show it runs nationally and until the DNC can shut down the TV networks to remove Florida from the union, national ads will run there. The idea that it’s Obama breaking the rules is nuts, it’s money down the toilet - Florida has no delegates. The Clinton campaign would love to see the Florida ban prevent Obama from buying national ads. It’s BS.
It’s a crappy situation but the better candidates - Obama and Edwards - aren’t trying to exploit it for political gain.
There are two issues here and they are separate:
1. The DNC screwed up big time
2. Only one candidate is trying to exploit the screwup to her advantage
– Steve
January 29th, 2008 at 12:57 pm
[…] because of a rules dispute between the state and the Democratic National Committee. Reader Alex points out how crappy it is for Florida Democrats to not have their votes […]
January 29th, 2008 at 1:16 pm
I hope that the DNC sees the light and eventually counts Florida’s delegates. If they refuse, I may never vote Democratic again. Not counting Florida’s delegates would be a tremendous slap in the face to Floridians. I can’t imagine that even the Democratic party would be that stupid. How does disenfranchising an entire state help the party? How does punishing the voters, the same people they claim to court help?
Obama’s excuse for running ads in Florida might be valid if there was no way to avoid running ads in Florida. I have seen no ads for any other Democratic candidate, not Hillary, not John Edwards. Somehow they managed to avoid Florida. If Obama really cared about party rules, he would have made sure his ads didn’t run here. That the ads ran proves that he cares little for rules when they are inconvenient. If Obama is going to be a sticker for the rules, he should obey them no matter how inconvenient or stupid. If he had to avoid buying national ads, that’s the price for obeying the rules.
I don’t care about the supposed Clinton smokescreen. I didn’t hear about Obama’s ads from Hillary’s campaign, I saw the ads myself, several times. Obama should have made sure his ads didn’t run here. I would call that a convenient way of exploiting the rules to his benefit. He is no better than Hillary in that.
January 29th, 2008 at 2:19 pm
I’m not disagreeing with how badly the DNC played this Alex. Don’t get me wrong. This was incredibly stupid. Michigan and Florida are too important in the general election and it’s amazing the DNC would be so stupid as to disenfranchise its members. I totally agree with you on that.
We part ways after that…
Comparing Obama’s ads incidentally running in Florida and Hillary’s efforts to exploit the injustice to Florida voters is apples and oranges.
For the sake of argument, what is the benefit of advertising where the delegates don’t count?
None.
If there’s no benefit, there’s no exploitation.
BUT retroactive trying to get delegates in places where campaigns could not effectively compete is wrong - it’s pitting the Democrats against the party and by arguing on their behalf - she’s getting to effectively campaign there - without campaigning - and attacking her own party in the process.
I’m with you though. I hope Florida’s delegates do get counted in some fashion. Apparently Delaware had their delegates stripped in 1996 for a rules violation. If I can find out what happened to them at the convention, I’ll post about it.
I hope Florida gets its delegates, I hope your voice is heard and I appreciate your post.
Best wishes!
– Steve
January 29th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
Steve,
I understood your point. I am just frustrated with the monumental stupidity of the DNC. Its like they are trying with all their might to lose an election that is theirs to lose.
I disagree with you on one point. I think eventually the DNC will have to back down on the delegate issue. Imagine that Obama wins the nomination based on delegate count without Michigan or Florida. Imagine also that if the delegates from Michigan and Florida were counted, Hillary would win (the reverse example is also valid). Would it be fair to declare a winner without those delegates? I don’t think so. Which group of voters should the DNC piss off? Can we afford to splinter and alienate any group of Democratic voters? At this point there is no good choice, you are going to anger some voters, but counting all the delegates at least has the virtue of enfranchising all voters. Only one choice makes gut sense. Yes, if you stick by the DNC’s stupid rules, you should punish the innocent voters and discard their votes, but that is not an auspicious way to become the official Democratic candidate. It would be like a self inflicted 2000 election debacle. I wouldn’t want my candidate to be declared such a “winner.”
Then again that assumes that the DNC would make the smart choice …never mind, we are screwed.
Keep up the great work on Socks and Barney. We need more intelligent political discourse. Thanks for considering my points.
January 29th, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Making the delegates count in some respect is the best solution, but they certainly can’t take Michigan as-is. Hillary was the only person on the ballot. The decision there is give them to her, or give them to nobody. Edwards and Obama didn’t have a fair stake.
The same goes for Florida. I’m not sure if all 3 names were on the ballot, but the lack of active campaigning (Obama’s phantom TV ads aside) will have certainly affected results.
The best solution, in my mind, would just to have a second primary in those states before the DNC tallies their delegates. It might not be until the end of the primary season, and may impact the results just as much (or as little) as those other states after Super Tuesday, but its’ better than not counting at all.
Putting forth a candidate who didn’t “really win” will be a shot in the foot. I can imagine the negative ads now.
January 29th, 2008 at 7:06 pm
Eric,
The top three democrats were on the Florida ballot, as well as Biden, Richards even Mike Gravel, I think. I don’t remember seeing Kucinich however, then again I wasn’t looking for him. According to Wikipedia all the Dems were on the ballot . No Democratic candidate can claim they were not represented.
I see your point on the vote on Michigan, but I don’t think it applies here. As far as campaigning goes, the only way most of the people in Florida see the candidates is on TV. Some may attend a rally, but the vast majority get their info about the candidates from the media. As you can imagine, the last few weeks all you could hear was about the results from the previous primaries, the debates and the fights between Obama and Hillary. Anyone paying even a minimum amount of attention got an earful. The majority of the people who vote in primaries are the most motivated anyway. We are probably the most interested and informed of voters. We didn’t need ads to make up our minds.
I am not holding my breath for a second primary. It costs a lot of money to run an election, and months of preparation. Besides how valid will a vote be after most of the primaries are over and done with? The DNC screwed the pooch with it’s inane decision to disenfranchise Michigan and Florida, they are going to have to make good somehow or end up with a horrible mess on their hands and a splintered party. My money is on the Dems snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, again.
January 29th, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Alex,
Yeah, you’re right about Florida. You were actaully in the state and voted in the primary, so you have me there. I think that taking the votes as they stand, or at least at half-weight like the Republicans might work there. Michigan is a different story.
We can all agree that it’s a terrible situation, though.